FAQ Memberlist Usergroups Register Log in
Profile Log in to check your private messages Search

Organ donors
Goto page Previous  1, 2
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic     Forum Index -> General Discussion
Author Message
Violabelle



Joined: 23 Mar 2008
Posts: 183
Location: Springtime

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess I would clarify that you don't have to be rich, because Medicare/Medicaid will pay for many of these operations/meds, but you do have to actually *have* Medicare. Many people who qualify don't actually have all the forms filled out and such. This is why social workers are teh awesome.

...this is all unless you live in Arizona...

Seriously, health care in this country is ridiculously tricky to finance and it is nice that there are experts out there.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Tinu.



Joined: 23 Mar 2008
Posts: 3690
Location: The land of dreams

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 1:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Health care in the US hinges on one thing: Don't get sick. And good luck to you if you are.
We're supposed to switch over to a system similar to Canada's soon, aren't we?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Tinalles
Site Admin


Joined: 22 Mar 2008
Posts: 1630
Location: Grand Forks

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, no.

Canada has a single-payer system, meaning that the government pays for all health care expenses (except some elective procedures, like plastic surgery to make you more smexy). Citizens pay their taxes, they get medical care when they need it, and the government foots the bill. You can still pay for private health care if you want, but most people don't.

Anyway, the government is far and away the biggest purchaser of health care supplies, medicines, medical equipment, and so on -- meaning they have a lot of clout for negotiating bulk discounts on the stuff. It's not a perfect system, but it seems to work pretty well.

The new U.S. health care system won't kick in for a couple of years yet even if it survives the multiple law suits challenging its constitutionality. If I understand, it works basically like this:

1) Every citizen is required to get health insurance. Either you buy it yourself, or you get it from your employer as part of your job.

2) If you opt NOT to buy health insurance and do not get it through your job, the government charges you more taxes.

3) Each individual state is supposed to set up a state-run health care program called an exchange, to offer cheap health care policies to people who can't afford it regularly. There will also be subsidies for the poor.

So, instead of having a single payer system, we'll basically have the existing system of for-profit health care companies, only with fifty new non-profit health care programs run by the states. The key to making it work is the mandate that everybody has to have health insurance, because the much larger pool of insurees makes it a lot easier to spread the risk around. Or that's the theory anyway; I'm not entirely convinced that it'll work, since although the number of insured people will increase, they'll still be segmented across 50 state insurance providers and heaven knows how many private companies.
_________________
Keeper of The Remnant Minuon (cognomen Lucy, the Eaten One) and the Emissary Caeli
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Tenshi



Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Posts: 2594
Location: Star Stuff

PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 2:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

..I think I like Canada's better.
_________________
. Dubbed "Usagi" by AsA .
Keeper of the Siderean Swords

"If by chance some day you're not feeling well, and you should remember some silly thing I've said or done, and it brings back a smile to your face or a chuckle to your heart, then my purpose as your clown has been fulfilled."
Red Skelton
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Nem



Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 2141
Location: England

PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 10:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wonder how large a risk pool you need in order to self-insure under that system. Lots of companies over here self-insure their vehicles up to a point because they don't incur as many costs on top of the price of the risk as an insurance company would.
_________________
Never forget,
We stroll along the roof of hell
Gazing at flowers.
- Issa
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
Tinu.



Joined: 23 Mar 2008
Posts: 3690
Location: The land of dreams

PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 11:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm going to agree with Tenshi. That sounds incredibly unstable. Besides which, making everyone purchase health care would probably file under unconstitutional. If it makes it in a few years I'll be surprised.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Tinalles
Site Admin


Joined: 22 Mar 2008
Posts: 1630
Location: Grand Forks

PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I dunno; the constitutionality of the health care mandate can be argued either way. If I recall correctly, there are four separate challenges working their way through the court system right now. So far, two judges have declared it unconstitutional, and two judges have declared it constitutional.

Soooo ... not a clear-cut case either way.

Incidentally, here's a summary overview of the health care bill. There's quite a lot in there. The original is thousands of pages long after all.
_________________
Keeper of The Remnant Minuon (cognomen Lucy, the Eaten One) and the Emissary Caeli
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Tinu.



Joined: 23 Mar 2008
Posts: 3690
Location: The land of dreams

PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 7:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It rarely seems to be a clear-cut case.

Oh awesome! Thanks for the link!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Tamir



Joined: 22 Mar 2008
Posts: 1629
Location: Israel

PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darn, I can't believe I didn't catch this topic sooner. Need to work on my lurking.

Anyhow, I feel a need to respond to this:
Tenshi wrote:
Whereas there's a primary, centralized body of thought in Judaism (...)

Not really. Moreso than Christianity perhaps, but still, there's plenty of room for disagreement.

So, I'm here to bring some Jewish education. I happen to know a little bit about this issue because I volunteered in Israel's organ donation organization for a while, during which point I was religious.
As AsA said, there are indeed Jewish laws which would prevent organ donation. One is called "Nivul hamet" which forbids harming a dead body without reason (This is the one AsA referred to). Another is "Halanat hamet" which forbids delaying burial. A third is "Hana'at hamet", which forbids getting any kind of good/happiness from a dead body. However, none of these laws actually cause organ donation to be forbidden! As Judaism puts a huge emphasis on the value of human life*, it's agreed by almost all rabbis that none of the above laws should stand in the way of organ donation.

In fact, there is a halachic issue regarding organ donation, but it stems from an entirely different issue - when can someone be said to be dead? Organs are usually (in Israel, exclusively) donated in cases of brain stem failure. In such cases, the body can be kept in working conditioning using machines, though no person in history has ever recovered from brain stem failure. Unfortunately, some rabbis hold that a person cannot be claimed dead until their heart stops beating, and so taking organs from such a brain-dead person would be considered murder and naturally should be forbidden. However, most rabbis have agreed in recent years that brain stem failure is considered death and thus organ donation is allowed and even recommended. There's a long list of rabbis who have signed organ donation cards.

And as you can all imagine, I'm an organ donor.

*As another example of this, if someone puts a gun to a Jew's head and asks him to violate Jewish law, then he may violate all laws save three very important ones.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Asa



Joined: 10 Apr 2008
Posts: 3538
Location: Grammar Police HQ. Watch your language, I'm armed with the NYTimes Style Book AND Strunk and White!

PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 7:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the education and clarification, Tamir!
_________________
Self-styled Forum Grandmother, because I hand out nicknames and hugs whether you want them or not. ^_^

Keeper of the Library and the Gateway to Haven

Nem: "It's the sort of face you just know is getting ready to poke you with something sharp."
BS: "...then insist you eat a brownie."
__________________
If we shadows have offended,
Think but this and all is mended...
Give me your hands if we be friends,
And Robin shall restore amends.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Allicat



Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 1389
Location: Land of the troll.

PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 3:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, thank you, it was fascinating! I'll admit I don't know much about the religious views here so any information is most welcome.
_________________
He who does not eat cheese will go mad. ~ French proverb.

Keeper of the fallen leaves. 'Cos they're still pretty.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic     Forum Index -> General Discussion All times are GMT - 4 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2
Page 2 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum



Elveron phpBB theme/template by Ulf Frisk and Michael Schaeffer
Copyright Ulf Frisk, Michael Schaeffer 2004


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group